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> Islam and Corporal Punishment, Are we at an evolutionary dead end?
Bashar
Posted: Feb 5 2010, 05:17 PM
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QUOTE (Shamsuddin Waheed @ Jan 26 2010, 03:41 AM)
I think the original question is-basically- are ninety lashes appropriate in the Sharee'ah. On the other forum where this was discussed, someone was saying it should be 39, etc..

Also, are lashes appropriate at all for such an offense? What should be the response of the authorities to such a situation?

In terms of schooling, most countries allow physical [i.e. spanking or using a wooden cane on the buttocks or hands] measures for even minor offenses, not to even speak of 'assaulting' a teacher.


Obviously, the Qur'an is silent on these sort of things, even the Hadeeths [as far as I can tell] have little in the way of texts to show us what to do in such a situation. Allah allows societies, judges, etc.. to use their God-given collective intelligence to figure out these sorts of details. They make laws, even when not in the texts. Speeding tickets are perhaps a good example. This is called Ta'zeer in the traditional terminology.

What happened to the school girl seems extreme, to say the least.

On the story Brother Fauq related, I recently read that a good number of the "Morals police" [who ensure women are covered, men are praying in the mosques etc..] are themselves convicts who had their sentences reduced by memorizing some of the Qur'an!!

@BR. Bashar,

Since you work in the school system, my question is- How would such a situation be dealt with in your experience? What is an affective way to deal with unruly students?

wassalaam

A lot depends on the specific circumstances, obviously, but an assault such as the one in Saudi Arabia would prompt an expulsion from most US public schools. I don’t believe the police would get directly involved unless the act was so egregious the victim of the assault presses criminal charges. A thirteen year old girl trying to prevent an administrator from forcibly taking her cell phone is an important extenuating circumstance. In the US, educators are taught not to physically confiscate personal items from a student. From my experience, the best way to deal with such situations is (1) training for educators on how to handle these situations without escalating them and (2) a discipline policy that stresses logical consequences over punishments. Proper training probably would have prevented the situation because the principal would not have tried to forcibly take the cell phone but used other persuasive techniques, including a call home to the parent; and a discipline policy that is not so severe as to provoke these kinds of desperate acts over a relatively minor rule violation. What would have been the consequence had the girl simply surrendered the cell phone? That’s the question I keep asking myself.

This post has been edited by Bashar on Feb 5 2010, 09:22 PM
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